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Recordings & Discussions of Other Vocal Works: Main Page | Motets BWV 225-231 | Mass in B minor BWV 232 | Missae Breves & Sanctus BWV 233-242 | Magnificat BWV 243 | Matthäus-Passion BWV 244 | Johannes-Passion BWV 245 | Lukas-Passion BWV 246 | Markus-Passion BWV 247 | Weihnachts-Oratorium BWV 248 | Oster-Oratorium BWV 249 | Chorales BWV 250-438 | Geistliche Lieder BWV 439-507 | AMN BWV 508-523 | Quodlibet BWV 524 | Aria BWV 1127

Matthäus-Passion BWV 244
Conducted by Willem Mengelberg

V-1

J.S. Bach: Matthaeus Passion BWV 244 (Fragments)

 

Matthäus-Passion BWV 244: Excerpts

Willem Mengelberg

Amsterdam Toonkunstoor & "Zanglust" Jongenskoor (Chorus Master: Willem Hespe) / Concertgebouw Orchestra Amsterdam

Tenor [Evangelist]: Karl Erb; Bass [Jesus]: Willem Ravelli; Soprano: Jo Vincent; Contralto: Ilona Durigo; (Tenor [Arias]: Louis van Tulder; Bass [Arias]: Hermann Schey
Piet van Egmond (Organ); Johannes den Hertog (Harpsichord); Louis Zimmermann (Violin); Hubert Bahrwahser (Flute)

HM 0157
ADCD 109

Apr 5, 1936

CD / TT:

Recorded at the Concertgebouw, Amsterdam, Holland.

V-2

J.S. Bach: St Matthew Passion

Matthäus-Passion BWV 244

Willem Mengelberg

Amsterdam Toonkunstoor & "Zanglust" Jongenskoor (Chorus Master: Willem Hespe) / Concertgebouw Orchestra Amsterdam

Tenor [Evangelist]: Karl Erb; Bass [Jesus]: Willem Ravelli; Soprano: Jo Vincent; Contralto: Ilona Durigo; Tenor [Arias]: Louis van Tulder; Bass [Arias]: Hermann Schey

Philips / Naxos / Columbia

Apr 2, 1939

4-LP / TT:
2-CD / TT: 159:12

Recorded at the Concertgebouw, Amsterdam, Holland.
See: Matthäus-Passion BWV 244 - conducted by Willem Mengelberg
Buy this album at: Amazon.com | Amazon.com

Mengelberg Matthew Passion

Philip Peters wrote (April 30, 2001):
Ulissipo wrote:
< Thanks for the information. Will try and get A. Schweizer's book. As to Ramin, only once did I listen to his St. Mathew Passion – a curious, quite unique and extraordinary version, with perhaps the most outstanding Evangelist I've ever heard. >
YES! Finally someone who agrees with me about this. The evangelist is the largely self-taught Karl Erb who deserved the nickname Der andere lieber Gott which was bestowed upon him because of his sweet, flowing voice.

< I was never able to get the CD >
I found it at eBay.

< and am now pondering whether it is worthwhile getting Mengelberg's version: it should be very good, but I'm afraid tempi and sound reproduction might be a too strong offset. >
If you can stand Ramin you will love Mengelberg IMO.

Pieter Pannevis wrote (April 30, 2001):
(To Philip Peters) I have Mengelberg and I love it. Just the same for Anton vd Horst' MP.. It's an experience in itself, but very worthwhile !
"mit Herz und Mund und Tat und Leben"

Ulissipo wrote (April 30, 2001):
(To Pieter Pannevis) You're Dutch and your opinion should be partial. But you advised/judged well as to Leusink's Cantatas. So, I think I'll get the Mengelberg Passion.

Charles Francis wrote (April 30, 2001):
(To Pieter Pannevis) The restored performance is, I was told, available on two different CD labels - one acoustically acceptable, the other not. Which do you have?

John Thomas wrote (April 30, 2001):
The safest transfer to get is on Philips Dutch Masters available at Kuijper Klassiek:
http://www.kuijperklassiek.nl/ There's a possibly better (and more expensive) transfer from: http://perso.wanadoo.fr/mengelberg/

Teri Noel Towe wrote (May 1, 2001):
Take the one from the Mengelberg website! It is far and away the better transfer.

 

St. Matthew Passion - Mengelberg

John Thomas wrote (July 11, 2001):
Bradley Lehman wrote:
< Mengelberg on Philips, probably out of print. I got it used from somebody who lost the booklet and nearly destroyed all the discs, looks like they've been underfoot on gravel...but they still play. >
The Philips set is available from Kuijper Klassiek at http://www.kuijperklassiek.nl/ Not expensive, either.

I forgot to mention that there's a purportedly much better transfer of the Mengelberg SMP (I haven't heard it) from http://perso.wanadoo.fr/mengelberg/

 

Mengelberg

Bradley Lehman wrote (April 22, 2003):
Jim Morrison wrote:
< (who has also heard very little Mengelberg; any recommendations?) >
Pretty much everything he shook a stick at.

And there's NOTHING that can prepare you for the way he plays the rhythm in the second mvt of Beethoven 6.

Chrales Francis wrote (April 22, 2003):
[To Bradley Lehman] Does that include Bach's Matthew Passion? The worlds slowest opening chorus, I believe.

Bradley Lehman wrote (April 22, 2003):
[To Charles Francis] Clocks in at 10'56", almost a minute faster than Klemp's 11'46".

Wilhelm "Bill" Furtwängler brings it in at 8'43".

Just for comparison, these same three guys in the first mvt of the Brahms Requiem:

- Mengy 10'53"
- Klemps 9'56"
- Furty 13'03" (11/11/48) and 12'19" (8/20/47)

 

SMP Mengelberg

Peter Bloemendaal wrote (February 5, 2005):
MATTHÄUS PASSION BWV 244 - JOHANN SEBASTIAN BACH (1685-1750)

Conductor: - Willem Mengelberg
Choir: - Amsterdam Toonkunst Koor
Boys choir: - Zanglust (leader: Willem Hespe)
Orcestra: - Royal Concertgebouw Orchestra

Recording: - Philips Dutch Masters, ADD 462 092-2, 1997
Original recording on celluloid film
Location and time: - Concertgebouw Amsterdam 2 April 1939 (Palm Sunday)

Soloists:
Evangelist, tenor - Karl Erb
Christ, bass - Willem Ravelli
soprano arias - Jo Vincent
alto arias - Ilona Durigo
bass arias - Herman Schey
tenor arias - Louis van Tulder

Solo instruments:
Organ: - Piet van Egmond
Harpsichord: - Johannes den Hertog
Violin: - Louis Zimmermann
Oboe d'amore - G. Blanchard
Oboe da caccia: - W. Peddemors
Flute: - Hubert Bahrwahser

Total playing time (30 cuts): - 2hrs43'15"
Duration Opening choir: - 10'52"
Duration Final Choir: - 7'51"
Duration chorale "Herzliebster Jesus": - 1'28"
Duration "Sind Blitze, sind Donner": - 5'20
Last supper scene ("Er antwortete und sprach"): - 4'33"
Duration soprano aria "Aus Liebe": - 5'45"
Duration alto aria "Erbarme Dich": - 8'26"
Duration tenor aria "Ich will bei meinem Jesu wachen": - 6'03"
Duration bass aria "Mache dich mein Herze rein": - left out

Characteristics:

Abridged version by the greatest Dutch conductor of the first half of the twentieth century, Willem Mengelberg. He dominated the musical scene of his time with his highly individual approach of Bach and Mahler. His adagium that there is no such thing as an authentic approach, but that the conductor must help the creator by his own interpretation, led to a SMP performance that is typically Mengelberg. His interpretation does not show any fixed tempi. Instead we find frequent use of rubato. The strings abounded in portamento playing. Numerous changes and markings were made as to dynamics. We find doubling of instruments, doubling of voices where the boys choir joined the sopranos in a few chorales. Several times he had a trumpet double the sopranos in ripieno in the chorale "O Lamm Gottes, unschuldig". Later he introduced a larger mixed children's choir and after 1918 he had the organ double the trebles. Some of the most intimate chorales ("Herzliebster Jesu", O Haupt voll Blut und Wunden" and "Wenn ich einmal soll scheiden") he used to sing a capella. He never stuck to the required double or single chorus practice. He varied in his selection of single chorus turbae to be performed with both choruses (and orchestras) in order to create special dramatic effects. And then, of course he discarded as many as thirty parts from the original score, which was not very exceptional at the time however. His performances have always been controversial, although over the years the performances and the man behind them gained in status. Most critics praised him abundantly. They were impressed by his excellent leadership and moved by the expressiveness and the transparent sound he managed to create in spite of his vast forces. Others criticized him for the same reason. Neither the venue nor the massive sound were appropriate for Bach's oratorios and cantatas, since they were not written for concert halls but to be performed in church services by relatively small ensembles. Hardly anyone, however, blamed him for his over-romantic approach and tampering with the score. Only one critic remarked (as early as 1914) that Bach choirs should comprise no more than 16 singers. Another observed that the tempi of the chorales and most of the arias should be twice as fast as customary with Mengelberg and his contemporaries. He rebuked Mengelberg for his sluggish, gloomy rhythms which were in shrill contrast with Bach's light-footed dance rhythms, arguing that if Mengelberg would double his speed, as he ought to, practically all of the omitted parts could be reinstated. (Source: "De Matthäus Passion, 100 jaar passietraditie van het Koninklijk Concertgebouworkest").

List of the cuts Willem Mengelberg made in his 1939 SMP performance:

Buß und Reu, da capo - alto aria
Blute nur, da capo - soprano aria
Ich will hier bei dir stehen - chorale
Gerne will ich mich bequemen - bass aria
Die aber Jesum gegriffen hatten (partly) - recitative evangelist
Mir hat die Welt trüglich gericht - chorale
Und wiewohl viel falsche Zeugen (partly) - recitative evangelist
Geduld, Geduld - aria tenor
Bin ich gleich von dir gewichen - chorale
Des Morgens aber .(partly) - recitative evangelist
Was gehet uns das an? - turba , choir I,II
Und er warf die Silberlinge - recitative evangelist
Gebt mir meinen Jesum wieder - aria bass
Sie hielten aber einen Rat - recitative evangelist
Befiehl du deine Wege - chorale
Auf das Fest hatte der Landpfleger - recitative evangelist
Wie wunderbarlich ist doch diese Strafe - chorale
Können Tränen meiner Wangen - aria alto
Du edles Angesichte (verse 2 of "O Haupt...") - chorale
Und da sie ihn verspottet hatten (partly) - recitative evangelist
Ja, freilich will in uns - recitative bass
Komm, süsses Kreuz - aria bass
Sehet, Jesus hat die Hand - aria alto with choir
Und es waren viel Weiber da (partly) - recitative evangelist
Mache dich mein Herze rein - aria bass
Und Joseph nam den Leib (partly) - recitative evangelist
Herr, wir haben gedacht - turba choir I,II
Wir setzen uns, bars 25-36 and 105-116 - final chorus, Choir I,II

The cuts Mengelberg made were largely conform the ones made by Mendelssohn in his first version of 1829 and those made by the renowned Dutch composers and Bach-experts Johannes Verhulst and Julius Röntgen in the 1870's and 80's before the opening of the Concertgebouw. Röntgen had close contacts with his German friend and colleague Heinrich von Herzogenberg, who was a co-founder of the Leipzig Bach-Verein and a friend of the famous Bach biographer Philipp Spitta. Röntgen had worked with Herzenberg in his 1883 performance of SMP in the Thomaskirche in Leipzig.

My calculations, based on a comparison with the Klemperer recording of 1961, show that Mengelberg would have needed at least 78 more minutes, should he have wanted to perform and record the entire passion without any cuts. The implication would have been a concert of more than 4 hours, approximately one hour and 40 minutes before the interval and 2 hours and 40 minutes after it, assuming that they wished to follow Bach's partition. It stands to reason then, that cuts had to be made in order to avoid such a marathon concert. For us though, it is amazing that for more than a century none of the conductors who ventured to take up SMP would consider to observe Bach's own tempi.

Mengelberg:

In 1898, at the age of 27, Willem Mengelberg was appointed conductor of the Toonkunst Koor (Choir of Tonal Art), Amsterdam. From the very start his intention was to raise the level of choral singing to the standard of the Concertgebouw Orchestra, whose conductor he had already been since 1895. To this aim he introduced a strict regime of separate rehearsals for men and women, based on quality and artistry. He got rid of the lesser voices and set up entrance exams for novice choral candidates. He demanded rigid perfection and discipline, to such an extent that he even trained the choristers to get up, sit down and turn their pages simultaneously and noiselessly. Musically, he wanted the members of the choir and the orchestra to produce each note and marking (most of them his own) as accurately and beautifully as possible. He had a predilection for details, colorings on the vowels and highly dramatic effects. His thorough drills combined with his inspirational power enabled him to achieve a bright and transparent musical sound, in spite of a vast orchestra and a choir of more than 400 singers.

On 8 April 1899 Mengelberg staged his first concert hall production of SMP in the Amsterdam Concertgebouw, which would grow into an immensely popular annual tradition. Leading the CO for half a century, he built up an excellent reputation for himself and the orchestra and got international recognition as a leading Mahler and Bach interpreter. From 1907 till 1920 he also conducted the Frankfurter Museum Gesellschaft and from 1921 till 1930 the National Symphony Orchestra NY, later the NY Philharmonic Orchestra, where he was succeeded by Arturo Toscanini.

When World War II broke out, almost 70-year-old Mengelberg decided to comply with the Nazi oppressors. He became a member of the German Culture Cabinet, went on conducting the Concertgebouw Orchestra, was on friendly terms with the German regime as shown on a photograph with Reichskommissar Seyss Inquart, and let himself be used for Nazi propaganda. He had to denounce the works of his Jewish friend Mahler and even collaborated in expelling Jewish musicians from his choir and orchestra, although later he would claim to have helped some of them escape the deadly regime. After the war there was a general outcry of indignation at his immoral attitude during the occupation. Whereas in Germany and other countries collaborating conductors as Von Karajan and Böhm were quickly restored to public favor and continued their impressive musical career, Mengelberg was banned from the baton, deprived from his passport and exiled to Switzerland, where he died a wronged and misunderstood man in his Swiss home, shortly before the ban was lifted in 1951.

It took the stubborn and unforgiving Dutch about half a century to get over the sharp controversies of the past. Today there is a renewed interest in Mengelberg's work and a general feeling that we should be grateful for the historical role he played in gaining a grand international status and recognition for the Royal Concertgebouw Orchestra. Riccardo Chailly, who recently retired as chief conductor of the Concertgebouw, expressed these feelings in 2001, when he placed a wreath on Mengelberg's grave in Luzern as a token of rehabilitation and gratitude.

Recommended links:
http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1947/m-pol.html
http://www.maurice-abravanel.com/mengelberg_english.html
http://www.classicalnotes.net/reviews/mengel.html

The Actual Recording:

The technical quality of the recording is surprisingly good. Througthe link below one will get very interesting information both about the production, the various releases and above all the technical processes involved.

How to rate the recording is not only a matter of taste. It also depends on the ability to relate to, to identify oneself with the musical director and his crew, the ability to look beyond the limits of our contemporary insights and views. A favorable review presupposes not only one's belief in the integrity and sincerity of the performing artists, but also respect and admiration for their achievements, their musical eloquence and expressiveness.

From Rudolf A. Bruil's site I quote what a music critic wrote in 1953 at the presentation of the Philips Minigroove edition of J.S. Bach's "Matthaeus Passion" which had been recorded nearly 13 years earlier.

I quote: 'When listening to the now released gramophone records again, one undergoes the spell of this perfect chorus sound, of the orchestra playing. One hears the unequaled Evangelist-performance of Karl Erb, the impressive part of Christ by Ravelli, one hears Jo Vincent, Ilona Durigo, Louis van Tulder and Herman Schey on the height of their artistic abilities and one realizes that this recording also in this respect is a historic document which will gain in value as our music life by lack of truly great figures will slip back to mediocrity.'

From the same source:

In 1939 Ilona Durigo was 57 years of age. Karl Erb was 62 and Mengelberg himself was 68. Louis Zimmermann, who had been concert master of the Concertgebouw Orchestra since 1911, played the violin solos. He was 65 years of age.

The oboe players were George Blanchard (born in Brussels) who played in the orchestra from 1904 until 1943), and W. Peddemors. Hubert Barwahser played flute. The youngest performer of importance was organist Piet van Egmond aged 27. Of the singers Willem Ravelli at 46 was on the top of his career as were Jo Vincent (41), Louis van Tulder (46) and Herman Schey (43). Their ripened insights and sublime artistry contributed immensely to the compelling performance.
http://www.soundfountain.com/amb/phmil.html

Is my personal evaluation important to your appraisal? Must you be aware of the fact that I sing in Holland Boys Choir? Does it matter that my favorite Bach interpreters are Herreweghe and Suzuki? Do you need to know that I can imagine what listeners experienced at the time? I don't think so. What counts is that you sit down, relax, take your time, play the record, let the music take you away and give Mengelberg c.s. a real chance to convince you of their version of Bach's great passion. Only then you will know.

Yoël L. Arbeitman wrote (February 5, 2005):
Peter Bloemendaal wrote:
< After the war there was a general outcry of indignation at his immoral attitude during the occupation. Whereas in Germany and other countries collaborating conductors as Von Karajan and Böhm were quickly restored to public favor and continued their impressive musical career, Mengelberg was banned from the baton, deprived from his passport and exiled to Switzerland, where he died a wronged and misunderstood man in his Swiss home, shortly before the ban was lifted in 1951. It took the stubborn and unforgiving Dutch about half a century to get over the sharp controversies of the past. >

Two of Mengelberg's Mahler recordings:
"Lieder eines fahrenden Gesellen"
Hermann SCHEY Willem MENGELBERG Koninklijk Concertgebouworkest, Amsterdam
live Nov.23.1939
and
"Symphony no. 4"
1939 Willem MENGELBERG Joe VINCENT Koninklijk Concertgebouworkest, Amsterdam
live Nov.9.1939

remain amongst my very favorite Mahler recordings and I have a few.

Notice that Hermann Schey (a jewish baritone of immense talent) was the singer in this extraordinary recording of LefG.

It was a great disappointment to me when I first received my copy of Mengelberg's MP that almost all the bass arias were excised.

There is a wonderful 2 CD set on Koch Schwann "Schlesische Sänger von Weltruf" which includes 8 arias and Lieder sung by Schey from 1927-1932. As to the "Stubborn Dutch", I cannot agree. Mengelberg paid a small price for his betrayal of his Dutch homeland. He was of mixed German and Dutch parentage, as I recall, and obviously had a stubborn loyalty to the country that would have murdered Mahler and Schey. He was a great musician and an man unaware up to the end of his actions and behavior. The Dutch people did no horrid thing to him and I applaud them greatly.

Eric Bergerud wrote (February 5, 2005):
[To Peter Blemendaal] Thanks Peter for a really interesting contribution.

Amazon had about 25 minutes of the work available for listening which I utilized. Well, things have changed. I do not insist on top quality sound on my recordings. That said, I long ago sold my once fairly sizeable collection of recordings from the early 30's - early 50's simply because the sound was so poor that I didn't listen to them. But, as you point out, today's engineers do their job well and the sound was a distraction but not fatal.

But 78 minutes longer than Klemperer? Yikes. Going at that rate Mengelberg could have filled most of a concert with the Egmont Overture. (At least I can't carp about a lack of boys.) Peter is of course correct that one must respect performers of a different era - the audiences were demanding and the music loved. I admire Klemperer, or Richter for that matter, but I can't say that I like them. Too much water under the bridge I guess. Pity that Toscanini didn't play more Bach. At least there would have been an alternative to the Romantic approach. The audience that grew up with Mengelberg, Furtwangler etc must have found early HIP choral music a profound shock indeed.

Just checked another reference on the degree to which Bach performance has changed. Cleobury, Kings Choir and the AAM did a Magnificant and a couple of cantatas on an EMI Classic (good stuff). The liner notes give a history of Bach at Kings College. There is no sign of choral Bach at all at Kings until 1910 when some chorales in English translation were introduced. The author notes that King's Choir was considered too small for the passions. The first cantata recording didn't appear until 1959 - in English. In 1960 a SJP was performed, in English, and noted for its small forces. The first German language recordings made by Kings were some motets done for EMI in 1967. It wasn't until the association with Harnoncourt began in 1970 that King's became a serious Bach choir. When Roy Goodman joined Cleobury the choir and consort became serious players on the Bach scene. Any way you look at it, that's a lot of change in a short time. And for once we can talk about progress - or at least I think so.

BTW: Didn't realize Mengelberg was a collaborator. Can't say that I know how Karajan escaped without a blot. A wonderful movie starring Harvey Keitel and Stellan Skarsgard called Taking Sides (2002) gives a powerful account of the US efforts to end Furtwängler's career. Keitel, who plays the US officer in charge of the effort, is portrayed as something of a donkey. Unfairly, I think, as Furtwangler did have much to answer for. As it was, his "punishment" was never to be given a visa to the USA. Wonder how Furtwangler and Toscanini or Walter would have gotten along if he'd come to conduct the NYP? Anyway, the flick is widely available and recommended highly.

Doug Cowling wrote (February 6, 2005):
Eric Bergerud wrote:
< Too much water under the bridge I guess. Pity that Toscanini didn't play more Bach. At least there would have been an alternative to the Romantic approach. >
Guess who conducted the slowest "Parsifal" in history, a record still unbroken at Bayreuth? -- Arturo Toscanini!

Teri Noel Towe wrote (February 6, 2005):
SMP Mengelberg - observing Bach's own tempi

Peter Bloemendaal wrote:
< For us though, it is amazing that for more than a century none of the conductors who ventured to take up SMP would consider to observe Bach's own tempi. >
The fastest recorded performance of the opening chorus of the SMP also is the first one, which was recorded in 1928.

The conductor Siegfried Ochs (1858 - 1929), the founder and director of the Berlin Philharmonic Choir. Ironically, notwithstanding his interest in Bach in particular and early music in general, Ochs was apparently a conservative interpreter. Through at least one of his teachers and mentors, the violinist Joseph Joachim, he stood in a direct line of pedagogical descent from Mendelssohn-Bartholdy himself, and his brisk urgent tempos and long legato phrases have their origins in the essentially late Classical style in which both Mendelssohn-Bartholdy and his colleagues in Berlin and Leipzig performed their own music and that of their antecedents.

It comes, therefore, as a shock for those who hear it for the first time to discover that Ochs's recording of the opening chorus of the SMP is the exact opposite of the interpretations that the well-known Mengelberg performance had previously misled them to assume to have been the norm in the 19th and early 20th centuries. Split over two sides of a 12" 78 with plenty of room to spare on the second side, "Kömmt, ihr Töchter" last 5 minutes and 26 seconds, less than half the time it takes Mengelberg to make his stately and effusive progress through the same music.

Like Bach himself, and Mendelssohn-Bartholdy, too, evidently, Ochs liked his tempos fast.

Ochs's 1912 Berlin performance, by the way, appears to have been only the second complete and uncut performance since Bach's own. The first was given in Karlsruhe in 1907. The conductor was Felix Mottl.

Yoël L. Arbeitman wrote (February 6, 2005):
Mottl

Teri Noel Towe wrote:
< The first was given in Karlsruhe in 1907. The conductor was Felix Mottl. >
The selfsame man who gave the first integral performance of Les Troyens about (maybe 20 years after Berlioz's death).

Teri Noel Towe wrote (February 12, 2005):
[To Yoël L. Arbeitman] If I am reading the entry on Felix Mottl in Grove 3 correctly, the event apparently took place after Mottl received his appointment at the Opera in Karlsruhe, and that first integral performance was part of a cycle in which all of the Berlioz operas were performed.

Teri Noel Towe wrote (February 12, 2005):
Mengelberg's abridgement of SMP

Peter Bloemendaal writes:
< I do not know that Mengelberg's abridgements are targeted at anything, but that they came from necessity. He just followed common practice to be able to cram his exceedingly slow romantic conception in a seizable concert. And then, even his shortcut version was too long for some of the concertgoers, who took a premature exit.>
I guess that it depends to some extent on how one defines necessity.

Whatever the motivation may have been, Mengelberg was not casual about the process of deciding what was going to be omitted. As Martin Elste makes clear in his book, WM had had long experience with BWV 244. On page 205, Martin reproduces the first page of WM's conducting score. The markings are those of someone who has thought long and hard about the implications of what he is doing.

Incidentally, there is one additional bit of circumstantial evidence that would support the contention that Mengelberg did not consider BWV 244 a work that could be performed for modern audiences, complete and uncut. There is absolutely no evidence that he ever considered breaking the work over two days or two concerts on the same day, as Pablo Casals did in New York in 1963 or 1964. Had the duration been the only issue, Mengelberg would have solved the problem that way. And besides, even at his tempos, and with all the cuts restored, it still would be shorter than "Gotterdammerung" or "Parsifal."

With regard to a previous posting in this series, I need to add that having a peak at Martin's observations about these recordings reminded me that there is yet another recording of a Nazi era performance that I had forgotten. That's the Hans Weisbach broadcast performance from 1935. I am fairly confident that the effect of the cuts will be the same as those of the Ramin and the Kittel.

Yoël L. Arbeitman wrote (February 12, 2005):
Teri Noel Towe wrote:
< If I am reading the entry on Felix Mottl in Grove 3 correctly, the event apparently took place after Mottl received his appointment at the Opera in Karlsruhe, and that first integral performance was part of a cycle in which all of the Berlioz operas were performed. >
Thanks, Teri, for some further information. The actual dates are as follows and there is indeed a lapse of 21 years after Berlioz's death:

Felix Mottl 1907 gave the first complete performance of The Matthäus-Passion in Karlsruhe (the first complete since the death of Bach).

Felix Mottl Dec., 1890 first gave the first complete (sensu lato) performance of Les Troyens in Karlsruhe (ever).

As to "all the Berlioz operas", there are precisely three completed and extant ones The mad and wild Malvenuto Cellini. I would assume that Mottl gave this is the 2nd Weimar version, Franz Liszt's well-intended butchery. The majestic and subline Les Troyens of which only Les Troyens à Carthage had been given in Berlioz's life time and it in not very satisfactory form.The delicate "surrender to acceptability" of his old age Béatrice et Bénédict. The earlier Les Francs-Juges and La Nonne sanglante exist today only in fragments both of them them recorded as airchecks but not officially. La Nonne sanglante as an opera was latter taken up by Gounod. So If Mottl gave "all the Berlioz operas", that would not be like giving all the Wagner or all the Verdi operas, for instance. Any further information appreciated inasmuch as the Berlioz bios and CD notes are always emphasizing the English contribution to the Berlioz revival starting in 1957 and even forgetting Beecham of 1947. Berlioz to me sounds great in German. I have two performances of Die Trojaner (one is a truncated Funkfassung with Rössl-Majdan, Traxel, et al. under Müller-Kray) and likewise under this same conductor Helmut Krebs did four of Die Sommernächte auf Deutsch as well as the fabulous Otto von Rohr doing Herod's aria from Des Erlösers Kindheit, as I recall the title.There is of course the interesting Fausts Verdamnis under Furtwängler. No
Cellini as far as I know. Best, Énée

 

Willem Mengelberg, Bach's St. Matthew Passion and The Philips Miller...

Teri Noel Towe wrote (August 23, 2006):
Click here: Willem Mengelberg, Bach's St. Matthew/Matthäus Passion and The Philips Miller Optical Recording System

Bradley Lehman wrote (August 24, 2006):
[To Teri Noel Towe] A very interesting article, thanks. Do you know if there are any plans to update it further, comparing the newest Naxos issue of that classic performance into the pool as well?

Yoël L. Arbeitman wrote (August 24, 2006):
[To Bradley Lehman] And perhaps putting Schey's arias back into the recording:-).

Goodness I have this in Hubert Wendel's (three jewel cases) private issue (with which he included two more CDs in their own jewel cases on him playing Bach organ stuff). I don't think I ever want to hear this de-aria-ed performance again (the article mentions slight cuts). Good coverage of the man's assocations with his fatherland (not Holland).

 

Matthäus-Passion BWV 244: Details
Recordings: 1900-1949 | 1950-1959 | 1960-1969 | 1970-1979 | 1980-1989 | 1990-1999 | 2000-2009 | 2010-2019 | Individual Movements
General Discussions:
Part 1 | Part 2 | Part 3 | Part 4 | Part 5 | Part 6 | Part 7 | Part 8 | Part 9 | Part 10 | Part 11 | Part 12 | Part 13 | Part 14 | Part 15 | Part 16 | BWV 244a | BWV 244b
Systemetic Discussions:
Part 1: Mvts. 1-8 | Part 2: Mvts. 9-20 | Part 3: Mvts. 21-29 | Part 4: Mvts. 30-40 | Part 5: Mvts. 41-50 | Part 6: Mvts. 51-57 | Part 7: Mvts. 58-63b | Part 8: Mvts. 63c-68 | Part 9: Role of the Evangelist
Individual Recordings:
BWV 244 - L. Bernstein | BWV 244 - F. Brüggen | BWV 244 - J. Butt | BWV 244 - R. Chailly | BWV 244 - S. Cleobury | BWV 244 - J. Daus | BWV 244 - D. Fasolis | BWV 244 - W. Furtwängler | BWV 244 - J.E. Gardiner | BWV 244 - W. Gönnenwein | BWV 244 - P. Goodwin | BWV 244 - E.z. Guttenberg | BWV 244 - N. Harnoncourt | BWV 244 - P. Herreweghe | BWV 244 - R. Jacques | BWV 244 - H.v. Karajan | BWV 244 - O. Klemperer | BWV 244 - T. Koopman | BWV 244 - S. Koussevitzky | BWV 244 - S. Kuijken | BWV 244 - F. Lehmann | BWV 244 - G. Leonhardt | BWV 244 - P.J. Leusink | BWV 244 - E.&R. Mauersberger | BWV 244 - H. Max | BWV 244 - P. McCreesh | BWV 244 - W. Mengelberg | BWV 244 - K. Münchinger | BWV 244 - R. Norrington | BWV 244 - G. Oberfrank | BWV 244 - S. Ozawa | BWV 244 - A. Parrott | BWV 244 - G. Ramin | BWV 244 - S. Rattlr | BWV 244 - K. Richter | BWV 244 - H. Rilling | BWV 244 - H.J. Rotzsch | BWV 244 - H. Scherchen | BWV 244 - G. Solti | BWV 244 - C. Spering | BWV 244 - M. Suzuki | BWV 244 - J.v. Veldhoven | BWV 244 - B. Walter | BWV 244 - F. Werner | BWV 244 - M. Wöldike
Articles:
Saint Matthew Passion, BWV 244 [T.N. Towe] | Two Easter St. Matthew Passions (Plus One) [U. Golomb] | St. Matthew Passion from Harnoncourt [D. Satz] | The Passion according to Saint Matthew BWV 244 [J. Rifkin] | The Relationship between BWV 244a (Trauermusik) and BWV 244b (SMP Frühfassung) [T. Braatz] | Matthäus-Passion BWV 244 - Early History (A Selective, Annotated Bibliography) [W. Hoffman] | Spiritual Sources of Bach's St. Matthew Passion [W. Hoffman] | Bach and the "Great Passion" [D.G. Lebut Jr.] | The Genesis of Bach's `Great Passion': 1724-29 [W. Hoffman] | Early Performances of Bach's SMP [T. Braatz]

Willem Mengelberg: Short Biography | Concertgebouw Orchestra Amsterdam | Recordings of Vocal Works | BWV 244 - W. Mengelberg

Recordings & Discussions of Other Vocal Works: Main Page | Motets BWV 225-231 | Mass in B minor BWV 232 | Missae Breves & Sanctus BWV 233-242 | Magnificat BWV 243 | Matthäus-Passion BWV 244 | Johannes-Passion BWV 245 | Lukas-Passion BWV 246 | Markus-Passion BWV 247 | Weihnachts-Oratorium BWV 248 | Oster-Oratorium BWV 249 | Chorales BWV 250-438 | Geistliche Lieder BWV 439-507 | AMN BWV 508-523 | Quodlibet BWV 524 | Aria BWV 1127

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Last update: ýMarch 16, 2010 ý08:49:00